Author Topic: Radisson - 2013 / Ivy & Princess  (Read 233616 times)

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Offline Ellie

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #820 on: June 04, 2013, 20:47 »
Thanks for all the ideas and answers............not an easy question I can see. Will watch wherever they decide to nest and worry like the rest of you. Such cute babies!

Offline PrairieSailor

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #819 on: June 04, 2013, 19:57 »
Maybe a one-time installation of a grate screwed down to the 'floor' of the ledge a few inches off the ground - would be snug & tight, still allow for visits but not nesting?  ???

The primary concern is safety, how do we maintain it and keep peregrines (and other birds), pedestrians, vehicles, property (our hotel and other buildings) safe?  We have had a number of ideas that would keep the birds off the ledge for nesting but still give them access to the ledge for other activities.  Problem is we can't just throw something up there and screw it down as appealing as that sounds  :) ... that will damage the roof and cause leaks into the meeting rooms which is an unnecessary cost and inconvenience for the hotel that hosts our birds.  We check and do any repairs/cleaning/replacing of our nestboxes twice a year, spring and fall.  And what about when the hotel has to do maintenance or window cleaning, what won't interfere with the work they need to do?  And when it rusts because of our wet and snowy weather?  or the points where it gets attached are compromised because we've drilled into it concrete (think freeze-and-thaw cycle) - then we have to redo it all again and we damaged the building unnecessarily and perhaps caused structural damage as well.  And how much will it cost to have someone working off a lift - no power, can't work when its at all windy or wet or cold for safety reasons, you can see it isn't a quick fix.  

Basically, we are thinking about what we might be able to do.  Then we will look to see if we can do it safely.  Then we will look at raising the money to do it.  Then we will look at how best to do it.  And then we'll do it.  Or not because its too dangerous, too expensive, the peregrines have moved (or become extirpated) or, or, or.  Technically we don't need to do anything and some would say that we shouldn't do anything because they are wild nesting peregrines who are choosing to nest there and "there" is no different from a wild nest on a cliff face (which is very true).  Let nature take it's course.  And that is just as reasonable as going through all sorts of hoops to block off access to a ledge that has been used 5 times (I believe) in 30+ years.  So there is an argument both ways.  In the meantime, I keep looking at options ...  ;)

Perhaps I am wrong - but it would seem to me the birds are attracted to a gravel base. I have seen many a roof in Winnipeg with ordinary patio blocks as a base. Per chance if you used those on that ledge, it would not significantly add to any cost, preserve the integrity of the roof and discourage future nesting desires ??

Offline Kinderchick

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #818 on: June 04, 2013, 19:47 »
Great screen captures, Jo! Good for you for learning how to take them & post them... something I still have to learn how to do. LOL! Cute little chick 2-some & egg pillow! :)

Offline Jo

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #817 on: June 04, 2013, 19:42 »


After the 7:30pm-ish snack

Offline Helen b

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #816 on: June 04, 2013, 18:08 »
 ;D just saw my first feeding this year at about 5:54 pm not sure but I think it was Princess.  Chicks look great and she was turning the egg around and put it back under her with the 2 chicks.

Offline The Peregrine Chick

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #815 on: June 04, 2013, 18:02 »
Princess is feeding the two chicks. The lone egg is still intact with what looks like a white pip. ::) TPC, is there still a chance for this egg to hatch?  ??? I forgot the dates the eggs were laid.  ???

It is Day 40 and I suspect that the egg won't hatch and that the parents will push it away or the chicks will move away from it (and their parents will go with them) ...

TPC, I have noticed that Princess uses her beak to scrape into the stones at times. Is it possible she is preparing an area to move the two chicks?

She is tweaking the nest scrape which is why we like fo call it "hoovering"  because it is the peregrine equivalent of housecleaning crossed with feng shui ... I must admit that it always seems to happen when  they look utterly bored but I could be anthropomorphizing  ;)

Offline Cooper

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #814 on: June 04, 2013, 16:58 »
Agree with you TPC. Why don't we humans remember that these are wild birds, wild nests and think positive, forget our angst, enjoy the good parts and in bad times know that nature is unpredictable, even humans can't be protected from natural disasters. We are lucky to even be able to watch via the camera. If there was no camera we wouldn't know what was happening and therefore we wouldn't worry so much. :)

Well said Rose! We are so lucky to be able to watch. I saw Princess hack up a pellet today! At first I thought she was choking and was instantly alarmed. When she'd accomplished the job, I had to laugh at myself. I'd never seen that before and had forgotten that, like owls, that's how peregrines rid themselves of the bones and whatnot.

Offline GCG

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #813 on: June 04, 2013, 16:10 »
Princess is feeding the two chicks. The lone egg is still intact with what looks like a white pip. ::) TPC, is there still a chance for this egg to hatch?  ??? I forgot the dates the eggs were laid.  ???

It is Day 40 and I suspect that the egg won't hatch and that the parents will push it away or the chicks will move away from it (and their parents will go with them) ...

TPC, I have noticed that Princess uses her beak to scrape into the stones at times. Is it possible she is preparing an area to move the two chicks?

Offline soaring west

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #812 on: June 04, 2013, 16:08 »
Just remember to turn my calendar for June.. The pinup bird is Princess on the calendar.  ;D

Offline Rose

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #811 on: June 04, 2013, 16:00 »
Agree with you TPC. Why don't we humans remember that these are wild birds, wild nests and think positive, forget our angst, enjoy the good parts and in bad times know that nature is unpredictable, even humans can't be protected from natural disasters. We are lucky to even be able to watch via the camera. If there was no camera we wouldn't know what was happening and therefore we wouldn't worry so much. :)

Offline The Peregrine Chick

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #810 on: June 04, 2013, 15:25 »
Maybe a one-time installation of a grate screwed down to the 'floor' of the ledge a few inches off the ground - would be snug & tight, still allow for visits but not nesting?  ???

The primary concern is safety, how do we maintain it and keep peregrines (and other birds), pedestrians, vehicles, property (our hotel and other buildings) safe?  We have had a number of ideas that would keep the birds off the ledge for nesting but still give them access to the ledge for other activities.  Problem is we can't just throw something up there and screw it down as appealing as that sounds  :) ... that will damage the roof and cause leaks into the meeting rooms which is an unnecessary cost and inconvenience for the hotel that hosts our birds.  We check and do any repairs/cleaning/replacing of our nestboxes twice a year, spring and fall.  And what about when the hotel has to do maintenance or window cleaning, what won't interfere with the work they need to do?  And when it rusts because of our wet and snowy weather?  or the points where it gets attached are compromised because we've drilled into it concrete (think freeze-and-thaw cycle) - then we have to redo it all again and we damaged the building unnecessarily and perhaps caused structural damage as well.  And how much will it cost to have someone working off a lift - no power, can't work when its at all windy or wet or cold for safety reasons, you can see it isn't a quick fix.  

Basically, we are thinking about what we might be able to do.  Then we will look to see if we can do it safely.  Then we will look at raising the money to do it.  Then we will look at how best to do it.  And then we'll do it.  Or not because its too dangerous, too expensive, the peregrines have moved (or become extirpated) or, or, or.  Technically we don't need to do anything and some would say that we shouldn't do anything because they are wild nesting peregrines who are choosing to nest there and "there" is no different from a wild nest on a cliff face (which is very true).  Let nature take it's course.  And that is just as reasonable as going through all sorts of hoops to block off access to a ledge that has been used 5 times (I believe) in 30+ years.  So there is an argument both ways.  In the meantime, I keep looking at options ...  ;)

Offline ballywing

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #809 on: June 04, 2013, 13:52 »
Maybe a one-time installation of a grate screwed down to the 'floor' of the ledge a few inches off the ground - would be snug & tight, still allow for visits but not nesting?  ???

Offline The Peregrine Chick

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #808 on: June 04, 2013, 13:51 »
Princess is feeding the two chicks. The lone egg is still intact with what looks like a white pip. ::) TPC, is there still a chance for this egg to hatch?  ??? I forgot the dates the eggs were laid.  ???

It is Day 40 and I suspect that the egg won't hatch and that the parents will push it away or the chicks will move away from it (and their parents will go with them) ...

Offline GCG

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #807 on: June 04, 2013, 13:37 »
Princess is feeding the two chicks. The lone egg is still intact with what looks like a white pip. ::) TPC, is there still a chance for this egg to hatch?  ??? I forgot the dates the eggs were laid.  ???

Offline The Peregrine Chick

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Re: Radisson - 2013 / June
« Reply #806 on: June 04, 2013, 13:21 »
I know this nest site is not a good one considering the tragedy previous.........could a grate be put in place on the top of it to prevent the PF's from using it? It is so unprotected from the elements. In nature there are at least tall grasses, shrubs, trees etc. around for protection. Just wondering!!!!

Actually this ledge is exactly the kind of place they nest on in non-urban or rather non-man-made environments.  Just gravel and some horizontal space.  They actually have more room on this ledge than many cliff ledges that are chosen for nests.  We humans are the ones that don't like this nest because we foresee the problems that can arise because of it.  As for installing something on it, one of the reasons we hate the ledge is because we don't have access and anything that gets put on that ledge really needs to be maintained and we can't do that reliably.  The risk is that whatever goes on the ledge could come off and then become a flying hazard for people or vehicles or property, or heck, even the peregrines.  So if we do something, it has to be safe, not interfere with Hotel operations and not be a hazard to the peregrines or other birds, but they will still visit the ledge even if we (the hotel and the Project) "do" something to it.  Not just a straight forward endeavour I'm afraid.