Author Topic: Netherlands / De Mortel - 2015 / Pa & Miep-VieVie (Read 28644 times)

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #120 on:** May 16, 2015, 14:35 »

those weights are all a little light - bottom of the range for each gender but they will do better now. And when they start hunting on their own they will probably make up the difference quickly enough. And because European birds don't migrate like ours do, they won't be burning off huge reserves over the winter and will be able to find places with lots of prey and stay there until the spring juices get flowing.

Barring fledging accidents, I think these little guys will be okay. Miep-VieVie managed to get them through the really tough part.

Alison · « **Reply #119 on:** May 16, 2015, 11:30 »

The weights of the four chicks at banding are as follows:

First female: 740 grams
Second (probable) female: 675 grams
First male: 545 grams
Youngest and smallest male: 465 grams.

As of yesterday evening, the VWG images are gone again. This is the third time they have been taken down recently.

Alison · « **Reply #118 on:** May 13, 2015, 22:44 »

Quote from: The Peregrine Chick on May 03, 2015, 20:19

Thanks for posting the video RCF - two things of interest - the "large" bands are the size of our bands - and that is about 2/3 the size of the last knuckle on a woman's pinkie finger Don't know what his bands are made of though, some early bands were made in stainless steel, not sure if any were raptor bands and I have no idea if they were used in Europe. Ours are made of aluminium and weigh less than a penny.

The bird with two silver bands was a female from Germany. Actually, she is the second German female who has been seen at this nest in the past while. The first was a three year old from Essen.

I have read that Germany uses aluminum bands.

Alison · « **Reply #117 on:** May 13, 2015, 22:36 »

Quote from: The Peregrine Chick on May 02, 2015, 11:57

Okay, since this site needs a scorecard to keep the players straight (and so I can update the subject line if necessary), those of you who watch and translate this site, please help fill in the following blanks ..

Miep-VieVie (aka VieVie, VV) - resident female

Pa - former resident male ? no bands?

1R - aka One Ring? - food-stealing, chick-ignoring interloper?

2O - ??

VM - new resident male? food-feeding, chick-loving interloper?

thanks for helping clear up the players

Pa is banded; he has silver bands on both legs. As far as I know, he has not been seen recently. I hope he is still out there.

One Ring/2O is indeed a "food-stealing, chick-ignoring interloper". For instance, on April 27, Miep-VV brought in prey at least three times. The first two times, she was able to feed some to the chicks before 2O stole the prey. In the evening, she again brought in prey and took it into the nest to feed the chicks. 2O followed her and grabbed the prey, dragging Miep-VV and the prey out onto the platform. He kept tugging at the prey until he had it and flew off with it. Miep-VV and the chicks got none. 2O is also a son of Miep-VV and Pa.

VM is not a designation I had seen, but I will take a guess that it stands for "vreemde mannetje" which means "strange male" or "unknown male". I take it to mean the male known as Spikkel, for the speckled markings on his bib. He is the male currently at the nest.

Pa's bands.

Spikkel:

Alison · « **Reply #116 on:** May 13, 2015, 16:20 »

All four chicks have a good weight, including the littlest one. Miep-VV continues to do an outstanding job of raising these chicks without any help.

No food cache of any kind was found on the tower. The only prey remains found were of pigeons, and there was nothing left but the bones. It would seem that Spikkel is eating the food that Miep-VV brings to the nest, instead of hunting for himself.

Information from Piet on the Dutch forum.

Alison · « **Reply #115 on:** May 13, 2015, 12:57 »

Two males, one female, and the fourth chick is probably female, although she has fairly small feet.

And now they are all together in one corner, with an adult on the platform.

Alison · « **Reply #114 on:** May 13, 2015, 12:29 »

The chicks have been banded, and were returned to the nest a few minutes ago. Only two are visible on cam at the moment. I hope the other two are in the other corner, but would like to see all of them to be sure.

While the chicks were out of the nest, the leftovers and debris were removed from the nest and the camera lens was cleaned. Haven't seen Miep-VV back at the nest yet.

burdi · « **Reply #113 on:** May 13, 2015, 10:40 »

If you're able to watch, the chicks are about to be ringed any minute now.

allikat · « **Reply #112 on:** May 11, 2015, 16:28 »

Yes...After a rocky start, with several males in and out of the picture, Miep/VV has become quite a remarkable Mother.
...and VM, I think, has finally got it.

as he is bringing in prey to take care of his growing family.
It's been fun watching VM learn the ropes.

susha · « **Reply #111 on:** May 08, 2015, 22:36 »

Looks like VM is now behaving like a parent, trying to brood the growing chicks and bringing in dinner and feeding them

Things are looking up for this family!

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #110 on:** May 08, 2015, 17:13 »

Did a quick bit of basic math and at 14 to 16 days old, these chicks are unlikely to be in much danger now until they fledge in another 3-4 weeks. With a more tumultuous start, they may put on a growth spurt in the last 2-3 weeks before fledging. Won't hurt them any but you may notice they look markedly bigger each day and it may not be wishful thinking or an optical illusion.

irenekl · « **Reply #109 on:** May 08, 2015, 11:47 »

Sure would like to know what happened to Pa.

GCG · « **Reply #108 on:** May 08, 2015, 08:06 »

The chicks have recently been fed. Their crops are full and they are in faceplant positions. A little housekeeping is in order. Their nest is "well" feathered.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #107 on:** May 03, 2015, 20:19 »

Thanks for posting the video RCF - two things of interest - the "large" bands are the size of our bands - and that is about 2/3 the size of the last knuckle on a woman's pinkie finger

Don't know what his bands are made of though, some early bands were made in stainless steel, not sure if any were raptor bands and I have no idea if they were used in Europe. Ours are made of aluminium and weigh less than a penny.

Other thing of interest is how careful the bird on the ledge was once he saw the chicks - in part "where's mama so I don't get my butt kicked" and "why are these things all by themselves?"

RCF · « **Reply #106 on:** May 03, 2015, 16:52 »

A member of the Netherlands Peregrines forum and also a BCAW member posted this.

Ton Kuipers (Kuiko) saw 4 peregrines including VV, but the dubble-banded one wasn't Pa,
but a quite old peregrine with large metallic bands.

Here is a vid from this peregrine

Here is a link to her post where you can view the video
http://www.peregrinefalcon-bcaw.net/viewtopic.php?p=349726#p349726

allikat · « **Reply #105 on:** May 03, 2015, 13:39 »

Hope all is okay at this site.
I know it's nature, but I just hope that it settles down.
Not the greatest time to be battling when there are four rapidly growing chicks that need tending to.

burdi · « **Reply #104 on:** May 03, 2015, 09:34 »

There was more action going on in De Mortel this morning. I heard all the noise (about 11:40 NL time) and then saw comments saying Pa is back! Later, others said it was another strange falcon, and not Pa.

There is now a clip on BDL called “Another strange falcon” as well as a few nice videos about VM. Observers reported four falcons fighting above and around the tower while VV was in the nest. Things quieted down after a few hours, but I hope none were badly hurt.

burdi · « **Reply #103 on:** May 02, 2015, 22:57 »

I was unable to spend much time here the last few days but may still try to post some further information regarding this site - hopefully by tomorrow.

Although busy, I still try to peek in on various sites but unfortunately came across something that has me very worried right now!

allikat · « **Reply #102 on:** May 02, 2015, 20:55 »

Thanks RCF for responding to TPC's question.
Also, it seems that VM is fitting in with his new family.
The chicks look great and healthy and Miep/VV is one heck of a Mum!
This is my favorite time is the year - eggs, chicks = ❤️

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #101 on:** May 02, 2015, 20:28 »

Excellent - thank you RCF!

RCF · « **Reply #100 on:** May 02, 2015, 18:46 »

Quote from: The Peregrine Chick on May 02, 2015, 11:57

Okay, since this site needs a scorecard to keep the players straight (and so I can update the subject line if necessary), those of you who watch and translate this site, please help fill in the following blanks ..

Miep-VieVie (aka VieVie, VV) - resident female

Pa - former resident male ? no bands?

1R - aka One Ring? - food-stealing, chick-ignoring interloper?

2O - ??

VM - new resident male? food-feeding, chick-loving interloper?

thanks for helping clear up the players

2O and 1R are the same bird. He originally had two bands but one has come off and the number on the band was 2O. VM I believe is short for visiting male.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #99 on:** May 02, 2015, 11:57 »

Okay, since this site needs a scorecard to keep the players straight (and so I can update the subject line if necessary), those of you who watch and translate this site, please help fill in the following blanks ..

Miep-VieVie (aka VieVie, VV) - resident female

Pa - former resident male ? no bands?

1R - aka One Ring? - food-stealing, chick-ignoring interloper?

2O - ??

VM - new resident male? food-feeding, chick-loving interloper?

thanks for helping clear up the players

susha · « **Reply #98 on:** May 02, 2015, 09:00 »

This is great news! Thanks RCF!

RCF · « **Reply #97 on:** May 02, 2015, 08:02 »

Good news here, the male VM was feeding the the kids leftovers while Mom was gone.

https://youtu.be/txjQ_baiNjs

allikat · « **Reply #96 on:** April 30, 2015, 12:11 »

Quote from: burdi on April 30, 2015, 06:58

In an earlier post I mentioned seeing a falcon appear at the nest about 01:35 hours. I automatically assumed this to be 1R returning after having been dive bombed. Although, while he sat quietly sleeping it definitely reminded me of the way VM used to sit in that same spot at night (with his back to us).

Now in the daylight people were noticing he appeared darker than 1R and began watching for a leg band. Since no band was spotted it is believed this falcon who returned is VM.

There is a new movie to view on BDL (by Aaltje) called “VM back”

I noticed as well - thought it was weird that 1R was in the nestbox - just thought he was resting out of harm's way.
Guess VM is back - not off to a great start though as he is also stealing food from Miep/VV. Talk about a stressful situation for Momma bird.
All she wants to do is feed her chicks, but her mate(s) want to be fed first, and will do anything to take her hard work away.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #95 on:** April 30, 2015, 09:18 »

Just to go back to the photo on the 28th - those chicks look pretty good for their age, Miep-VieVie is hanging in there!! And it looks so are the kids. Only a few more days and regardless of size, they will be able to thermoregulate.

As for the fighting - usually that is gender specific, so male/male or female/female - and given that she has young chicks, I would be surprised if she joined in except right at the nestbox in defense of her young. An upside, defending the nestsite, even for 1R will get his hormones up and cranking which could be a good thing - site defense could reduce his begging and/or amp up his protective instincts which could include bringing in food for the chicks in response to their calling for food.

burdi · « **Reply #94 on:** April 30, 2015, 06:58 »

In an earlier post I mentioned seeing a falcon appear at the nest about 01:35 hours. I automatically assumed this to be 1R returning after having been dive bombed. Although, while he sat quietly sleeping it definitely reminded me of the way VM used to sit in that same spot at night (with his back to us).

Now in the daylight people were noticing he appeared darker than 1R and began watching for a leg band. Since no band was spotted it is believed this falcon who returned is VM.

There is a new movie to view on BDL (by Aaltje) called “VM back”

allikat · « **Reply #93 on:** April 29, 2015, 22:34 »

It's morning already? Is probably his question.
He looks alert on the edge of the platform.
I only hope for a good day, free of drama - but, for some reason, I think 1R/2O is in for a busy day.
Positive thoughts going out to this falcon family.

burdi · « **Reply #92 on:** April 29, 2015, 22:34 »

Here is a video from the FroonaCam on natuurkanaal nl -- Falcons fighting above the tower -- (video by Freddie / Goshawkeyes) on April 29 at 19:52.

About 1.47 mins into the recording a falcon flies from left to right of screen. Then, at about 1.50 mins a falcon flies in the same direction. During this time I cannot tell if 2O is on the ledge or not - but think he is because I hear him just as clearly. Still, from this particular attack I cannot tell if one or two were participating - though think only one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieGsrI3Gb1w

burdi · « **Reply #91 on:** April 29, 2015, 22:28 »

Allicat, I agree.

At 05:15 I saw 2O move out to the ledge. He is still sitting quietly.

allikat · « **Reply #90 on:** April 29, 2015, 22:25 »

It looks like 1R/2O is getting a good rest...hopefully.
Not a great time for this to happen when there are 4 new chicks.
Out of our control, but it's nature.
As I have written, nature is beautiful, but can be cruel at the same time.

burdi · « **Reply #89 on:** April 29, 2015, 20:53 »

I hope for a better day tomorrow as well. VV continues to do absolutely everything she can to help these chicks survive - while all this fighting has been going on. I’m so proud of her.

burdi · « **Reply #88 on:** April 29, 2015, 20:47 »

Allikat, I saw 2O back on the ledge at 02:35, looking a little shell-shocked. He then went into the box and is still sitting there quietly. Poor 2O … of course I am happy to see him … but hope he is not injured. I did see 2 falcons flying while VV was in the nest and 2O on the ledge, but not sure if the cams were in sync. At this point I do not know for sure if he was attacked repeatedly by 1 falcon or more.

allikat · « **Reply #87 on:** April 29, 2015, 20:19 »

I just had a peak at the cam and 1R/2O is inside.
Protecting his family/nestbox/territory no doubt.
I saw the videos - Was it 1 Falcon or 2 attacking him today?
Hopefully tomorrow will be a better day.....

burdi · « **Reply #86 on:** April 29, 2015, 18:07 »

A new video was added on BDL called “Trammelant!” (by Aaltje) which you may want to view. It shows a few of the numerous attacks 2O was dealing with.

Poor 2O (1R) was very distressed

, and not at all interested in the remaining food.

burdi · « **Reply #85 on:** April 29, 2015, 17:58 »

Another video of dive-bombing attack which occurred at 20:54:30 (also by Coriena Segeren)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFeNwyUirt0

(Sorry for any confusion but noticed I failed to report the time attack occurred in my original post.)

burdi · « **Reply #84 on:** April 29, 2015, 16:13 »

Link to video (by Coriena Segeren) which shows attack on 2O (1R) at 20:39:51, where he falls from the ledge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFmYYubjGKQ

burdi · « **Reply #83 on:** April 29, 2015, 14:56 »

The drama here just does not stop! Today (beginning about 19:00 their time) at least two other falcons were speed flying above the tower, and also heard sounds which may have been a falcon hitting the fence. 1R / 2O was dive-bombed a couple of times, and was seen falling downward from the ledge.

Darkness now and things have quieted down. So far - it is difficult to determine who was involved, but for me the situation remains very worrisome.

burdi · « **Reply #82 on:** April 28, 2015, 20:36 »

I have been following this site for many years, and have been missing Pa.

However, I'm continuing to follow much of what has been happening here, especially since the beginning of April.

Today, further information about One Ring (1R) has been reported - which may help us understand why 1R has appeared so comfortable (and seemingly quite at home) on the tower. It is 99.9% certain that 1R was born on the tower in 2013, and is now back at his original home! They believe 1R is 2O. The chicks banded in 2013 were 2O (male) and 2R (female).

For more details read the latest post under the heading “Weblog”, which can be found under the camera view for this site. There are also numerous comments on BDL, as well as other sites.

Alison · « **Reply #81 on:** April 28, 2015, 14:51 »

The chicks earlier today:

Later, there were a whole lot of feathers in the nest:

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #80 on:** April 28, 2015, 12:15 »

Quote from: Alison on April 28, 2015, 11:33

I don't know if the pic with One Ring in the box alone with chick/chicks is one which I posted around April 23. If so, I saw him actually kick the tiny chick, intentionally or otherwise. Fortunately the little one was okay, but I would not trust One Ring.

Peregrines are clumsy, big feet and all that, my thought is likely unintentional. Even experienced females getting off chicks can step on them or knock them out/over.

As for trusting 1R, most everyone watches this site more than I do, but I will try to find some time to get a look at the adults behaviour with each other and the chicks. Remember, infanticide and siblicide is not a peregrine trait - one of the reasons we are able to foster chicks in wild nests with such wonderful success. T-Rex raised two sets of chicks that weren't his own - one group was a box full of captive-bred chicks being hack released, another was a full nest of his father's young and he fostered 1 or 2 nests that included young of his own and unrelated foster chicks that came in at banding age. Doesn't mean bad things don't occasionally happen, but they are very isolated incidences and not something we should be expecting or even considering to likely happen.

Alison · « **Reply #79 on:** April 28, 2015, 11:39 »

Quote from: The Peregrine Chick on April 24, 2015, 13:21

According to the research, the chances of a female managing to keep chicks this young fed and warm is statistically impossible. I've seen the nestsite location and it takes time to hunt, catch (remember falcons like all predators miss more than they catch) and prep a meal for transport and feeding. All of which is time taken away from the chicks who at this stage are defenseless and unable to thermoregulate. Average hunting success rate is about 23% (23 out of 100 hunts are successful) - for resident pairs on their breeding territories in the breeding season (i.e., when they are motivated to hunt successfully) it is a bit better than that (39%). But that still means that they miss half the time under ideal conditions - a female on her own trying to provide food for herself and her chicks as well as all her other duties and personal needs is fighting a battle she likely can't win. If the chicks were older, she would need to hunt for bigger appetites but they wouldn't need her at the nest so much.

Interestingly a raptor scientist in the US was just asking if anyone has any reports of lone parents being able to successfully raise chicks - so far I don't think he has received any affirmative reports.

I think I may argue with the statistics on this kind of situation. I have seen an instance of a female peregrine raising her chicks alone after her mate was injured during incubation.

I have also seen a case where a female, who did have a mate who did not contribute, incubated, brooded, hunted, fed and raised her four chicks on her own.

And I can think of a number of cases in which a peregrine (male or female) has continued to raise chicks after the loss of, or injury to, their mate.

Depends on what the criteria are, perhaps.

Oddly, the same question was posed on the Norwich site the other day via Twitter.

Alison · « **Reply #78 on:** April 28, 2015, 11:33 »

Quote from: The Peregrine Chick on April 28, 2015, 09:01

Another day closer to the 10 day mark - that's a good thing. And the first of the chicks is almost a week old, youngest is 4 days old, that's another hopeful sign - Princess lost her first a couple of years ago because she wouldn't get off it when it rained and I think just didn't get enough food in the beginning. I could be wrong and it was wet/cold that got it but both are a problem when they are so young. These tots have made it this far, few more days and they are over a really big hurdle and Miep-VieVie is able to shift focus. Another good sign is that 1R has been in the box alone with the chicks (picture shortly after early hatches last week) and didn't seem to be aggressive towards them - just interested in the food. When Miep-VieVie doesn't have to stay with the chicks she can be more assertive with him about stealing because she can leave the chicks alone for longer without harm.

Many thanks for all the info in your posts, TPC. It is always really useful info.

I am continuing to hope that Miep-VV can get through this very difficult situation. It is good that she is extremely experienced at raising chicks, and also very tenacious.

I don't know if the pic with One Ring in the box alone with chick/chicks is one which I posted around April 23. If so, I saw him actually kick the tiny chick, intentionally or otherwise. Fortunately the little one was okay, but I would not trust One Ring.

allikat · « **Reply #77 on:** April 28, 2015, 10:51 »

Yes, it's strange, but good.
1R watches Miep/VV feed the chicks as though he's interested - but most likely, as I wrote before, just interested in the leftovers.
He shows zero aggression to them - so, as TPC wrote, once this chicks can thermoregulate, hopefully things will turn around, and maybe Miep/VV will give 1R a boot to the head.

susha · « **Reply #76 on:** April 28, 2015, 09:11 »

I see four chicks now - and they seem more the same size now. Must've been the camera angle before.

Thanks for your re-assuring posts, TPC. 1R is most definitely not showing any aggression towards the little ones, just greediness for their food! Fingers are crossed for a happy outcome.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #75 on:** April 28, 2015, 09:01 »

Another day closer to the 10 day mark - that's a good thing. And the first of the chicks is almost a week old, youngest is 4 days old, that's another hopeful sign - Princess lost her first a couple of years ago because she wouldn't get off it when it rained and I think just didn't get enough food in the beginning. I could be wrong and it was wet/cold that got it but both are a problem when they are so young. These tots have made it this far, few more days and they are over a really big hurdle and Miep-VieVie is able to shift focus. Another good sign is that 1R has been in the box alone with the chicks (picture shortly after early hatches last week) and didn't seem to be aggressive towards them - just interested in the food. When Miep-VieVie doesn't have to stay with the chicks she can be more assertive with him about stealing because she can leave the chicks alone for longer without harm.

susha · « **Reply #74 on:** April 28, 2015, 07:47 »

This is hard to watch. Can see just three little ones - fourth might be behind the others. One is so, so tiny. They've been alone for a while...I guess (hope) mom is hunting. $:-\$

allikat · « **Reply #73 on:** April 27, 2015, 20:47 »

1R is definitely taking the food away, ie: stealing.
Miep/VV and 1R were fighting over prey.
She won the first battle, but after a second attempt, 1R got his way and flew away with prey.
It would be nice if something snapped inside that head of 1R, but I'm not holding my breath.
Miep/VV is one amazing Momma falcon.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #72 on:** April 27, 2015, 10:24 »

Quote from: Alison on April 27, 2015, 09:28

Actually, there are four chicks, but they are very small and not really getting enough food to grow as fast as they should.

We had something similar at West Winnipeg with Jules - not the no support from her mate Beau, but the small size of her chicks early on. It was the stress of the location, they were very fast feeders so the chicks were much smaller pre-banding age. When we would move them at banding (I'm not suggesting this for this site), the parents were less stressed and the kids packed on the poundage. Jules and Beau are not part of Radisson genetic line so their chicks are quite a lot larger than the rest of our Manitoba chicks - Annie was banded as a female remember, we didn't do that by accident, that's the size he and his sister Aggie measure out as. Juliet came off the horrible nestsite and she's enormous to my eye and is still going strong at last report, so fingers crossed, one more week.

Alison · « **Reply #71 on:** April 27, 2015, 09:28 »

Actually, there are four chicks, but they are very small and not really getting enough food to grow as fast as they should.

If they can just make it past the first ten days, they should be able to thermoregulate and will have a better chance. It is a very difficult task for Miep-VV. I don't think she would become aggressive with One Ring while they are both in the nest, with four very vulnerable chicks at risk.

One Ring, however, is well fed. One of the pics I have saved of him shows him with a large crop.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #70 on:** April 27, 2015, 09:08 »

Miep-VieVie is looking at him but from the screen captures not that aggressively ... that could be a good sign. His behaviour towards her might be becoming more partner than scrounger (or maybe not) - could be his hormones are kicking in and he's responding to the chicks' requests for food etc. She may not be "letting" him near the chicks because a) she doesn't know him well and b) he's not actively trying to brood the chicks.

First hatch was on the 22nd, third (there are just three here yes?) was on the 24th. She's doing well - if she can get them all to the end of next weekend, their chances for survival should improve ... and 1R/One-Ring, might be more support or at least less interference.

Alison · « **Reply #69 on:** April 27, 2015, 08:56 »

Still no cams. Very cold and windy there today.

Miep-VV went hunting, was gone for some time and returned with a huge prey at 12:50 p.m.

Alison · « **Reply #68 on:** April 26, 2015, 21:29 »

Miep-VV earlier with One Ring, the perpetual scrounger:

Alison · « **Reply #67 on:** April 26, 2015, 16:32 »

Quote from: allikat on April 26, 2015, 14:15

The live cams are online.
I have been refreshing the other site (3 cam views), and still nothing.
The administrator wrote something on April 23rd about the interference. It's a long message that can be translated.
I too, saw Miep/VV bring in the banded prey(s) - their forum has mentioned they are banded Dove's.

I assume you are referring to Beleef de Lente? It is not a site I have ever used, but I did go over there to see if it was down too. The videos at that time were not loading, just spinning . . .

I read the message you referred to, in the Dutch version. I checked three Dutch forums, but found no reference to the cams being down on any of them.

I am suspicious that the ongoing problem between BDL and NK has not been resolved. When the cams were down before, people on the main Dutch forum were posting that they were ashamed and embarrassed to be Dutch, because of all the people around the world who were also affected by this infighting.

allikat · « **Reply #66 on:** April 26, 2015, 14:15 »

The live cams are online.
I have been refreshing the other site (3 cam views), and still nothing.
The administrator wrote something on April 23rd about the interference. It's a long message that can be translated.
I too, saw Miep/VV bring in the banded prey(s) - their forum has mentioned they are banded Dove's.

Alison · « **Reply #65 on:** April 26, 2015, 13:22 »

I have seen at least two banded pigeons brought in over the last couple of days; one had bands on both legs.

All three cams have been down since 16:39 on the two sites which I use. Don't know if they are just down, or if this is a continuation of the previous situation.

Nothing has been mentioned about this on the Dutch forum.

susha · « **Reply #64 on:** April 26, 2015, 13:20 »

All the prey that I've seen have been banded.

Same pattern seems to be happening with meals. Miep-VV brings back food. Feeds chicks and then One Ring comes to take the rest away. Last night, there was a large chunk of leftovers that Miep-VV seemed to be keeping for another feeding or two and it got taken away by One R. Again twice today. It certainly means that the nestbox is cleaner than last year, but I wonder how much of this Miep-VV can tolerate. Is she getting enough to eat herself? She's doing all the work it seems. Unless, of course, better scenario is that One Ring is the hunter and stashing food away and then taking the leftovers after a feeding...

Time will tell...

allikat · « **Reply #63 on:** April 26, 2015, 13:05 »

Yes, gemcitygemini, they are banded dove's (from what I read on their forum).

RCF · « **Reply #62 on:** April 26, 2015, 12:31 »

Quote from: gemcitygemini on April 26, 2015, 12:09

I have just looked at the nest cam and I am shocked by what I see. There is remnants of prey. But what is shocking is there is a band on one of the talons??? Has anyone any knowledge of what it is or what has happened?

I had a look and took a screen capture. There are a lot of banded pigeons there, so I think that's what it is.

I will post the scap if anyone asks to see it.

GCG · « **Reply #61 on:** April 26, 2015, 12:09 »

I have just looked at the nest cam and I am shocked by what I see. There is remnants of prey. But what is shocking is there is a band on one of the talons?

?? Has anyone any knowledge of what it is or what has happened?

allikat · « **Reply #60 on:** April 25, 2015, 19:14 »

It was interesting to watch him on the video.
It appeared as if he was paying close attention to what Miep/VV was doing, ie: feeding the chicks.
I could be wrong on that impression as it could be as simple as 1R just wanted to eat.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #59 on:** April 25, 2015, 15:50 »

He might be a first year bird ... some beg for food from their "mates" as though they are chicks. Madame here at the Radisson did that her first year in Winnipeg with T-Rex. T-Rex was the same age and he was hunting up food for chicks we were hacking and pushing it through the bars on the hack box and then he would have to feed Madame as well. The following year she was at the Radisson with Pop and had grown out of that particular behaviour. A couple of years ago I saw the same kind of behaviour from a female (?) at the Brandon Tower site (RCF might be able to confirm if this was an isolated incident or typical for that bird that year).

If 1R isn't contributing, so long as she can keep the kids fed, not to bursting, just enough to keep developing for the next week, the chicks' chances for survival will go up exponentially. If he steals the remains of meals, that's likely okay, there likely isn't much left - remember most of a bird is wings and feathers. Fortunately, at this age, her chicks can't eat much at a sitting so a good kill a day for them could keep them going and a kill for her will do the same. When the chicks can thermoregulate, she can be hunting nearby more and theoretically can stockpile more food to keep up with their growing appetites. For those who can remember food deliveries close to fledge age, it was just one pigeon per chick - that's about the equivalent of 1/2 a chicken breast.

allikat · « **Reply #58 on:** April 25, 2015, 14:50 »

Just watched a video posted on the site...
Now, did 1R bring that prey in, or was he in fact waiting to take it away so he could eat it or clean up?
Aside from watching this site 24-7, I don't know what the real deal is...?

allikat · « **Reply #57 on:** April 25, 2015, 13:50 »

I was watching as well Alison.
It looked to me like 1R was waiting for Miep/VV to hunt and prep the food for her chicks while he waited patiently to take it.
I don't know if this was his attempt at cleaning up, or basically just waiting to eat it.

Alison · « **Reply #56 on:** April 25, 2015, 13:08 »

Miep-VV just came back with food, and she has just finished feeding the chicks. As it was yesterday, the food she brought was not plucked or prepared for feeding.

She fed the chicks, while One Ring watched from the platform. When she had finished feeding the chicks, she settled down to brood them, keeping the remaining food right beside her. Within seconds, One Ring zipped into the nest, stole the food and was gone. I saw him do it.

If he is not going to help (and I am sure that he has not yet brought food), the least he can do is go and get his own food.

susha · « **Reply #55 on:** April 25, 2015, 12:06 »

59 degrees in Gemert right now. Not warm enough for wee chicks to be alone so long I'm thinking.

susha · « **Reply #54 on:** April 25, 2015, 12:01 »

I've been watching for a while as well, Ali, and haven't seen a feeding. Chicks were alone for a long time, so I'm guessing Miep-VV was out hunting and is hopefully well fed. Now what about those babies?!?

allikat · « **Reply #53 on:** April 25, 2015, 11:42 »

Just finished watching about 40 + mins of lonely chicks in the nestbox.
Miep/VV came back with zero food.
Now I don't know when another feeding took place, but, she came in the nestbox, looked around, hopped onto the front grid, not sure if she calling out or not, (sometimes I watch a different site that has 3 cam views which has no sound) flew off, then we could see two Falcons flying around. No food exchange.
I don't know what the temps are like there but, with a fresh hatch today, isn't 40+ minutes just a tad long?

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #52 on:** April 25, 2015, 09:48 »

Quote from: allikat on April 24, 2015, 14:48

Unfortunately, even with google translating the page, words don't get translated properly, or at all, and the conversation gets lost in the shuffle.
From what others have been witnessing and posting, 1R is eating a lot, and literally stealing food out of the nextbox (they call it "the closet" or "cabinet").
Perhaps it is to lure Miep/VV out of the box to get food, like TPC wrote about other falcon behavior?
She is coming back with food that appears to be "prepped".....
Maybe 1R is contributing more than what the spotters are seeing and they also don't realize it?

It sounds like 1R is cacheing food for Miep-VieVie. As for taking food out of the nestbox - that too we've seen - Princess in the last couple of years has often eaten food brought in - mostly by Ivy because he was a food-delivery machine. For those who watch this site more than I do, is 1R taking the food as she's feeding it to the chicks, or is he bringing it in and eating there, or something else? Parents will often clean up afterwards my eating what's left ...

RCF · « **Reply #51 on:** April 25, 2015, 07:53 »

Four hatches here now

https://youtu.be/HePMSOI3V3Q

allikat · « **Reply #50 on:** April 24, 2015, 14:48 »

Unfortunately, even with google translating the page, words don't get translated properly, or at all, and the conversation gets lost in the shuffle.
From what others have been witnessing and posting, 1R is eating a lot, and literally stealing food out of the nextbox (they call it "the closet" or "cabinet").
Perhaps it is to lure Miep/VV out of the box to get food, like TPC wrote about other falcon behavior?
She is coming back with food that appears to be "prepped".....
Maybe 1R is contributing more than what the spotters are seeing and they also don't realize it?

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #49 on:** April 24, 2015, 13:21 »

Not all males bring food to the nest, in fact it isn't unusual for males to leave food nearby for their mate. We've been used to a number of our males bringing food right to the box - then Ivy realized he wasn't going to get any time with the kids so he would make Princess leave. Smiley is even more proactive - he was using food to entice Princess into the nestbox to check out his scrape this year. I never saw Beau bring food into the horrible nest site in West Winnipeg - Jules always left to get it from him, often right in mid-air beside the building. Hart leaves food nearby for Jules too. And Simba was probably our most invisible male - only saw him when he and Madame were copulating. He was very good at keeping the larder stocked but wasn't into being very hands-on with the kids.

According to the rersearch, the chances of a female managing to keep chicks this young fed and warm is statistically impossible. I've seen the nestsite location and it takes time to hunt, catch (remember falcons like all predators miss more than they catch) and prep a meal for transport and feeding. All of which is time taken away from the chicks who at this stage are defenseless and unable to thermoregulate. Average hunting success rate is about 23% (23 out of 100 hunts are successful) - for resident pairs on their breeding territories in the breeding season (i.e., when they are motivated to hunt successfully) it is a bit better than that (39%). But that still means that they miss half the time under ideal conditions - a female on her own trying to provide food for herself and her chicks as well as all her other duties and personal needs is fighting a battle she likely can't win. If the chicks were older, she would need to hunt for bigger appetites but they wouldn't need her at the nest so much.

Upshot is, as ineffectual and useless as whichever male is around at the moment, he may not actually be totally uninvolved in the raising of the chicks, just uninterested in the chicks themselves. Remember these birds are hardwired to raise young and if the male around is not the "father" he may be hormonally playing a bit of catch up. Or he could be inexperienced - Hart last year looked like a disaster, but he wasn't. Only time will tell how she, he and their chicks will make out.

Interestingly a raptor scientist in the US was just asking if anyone has any reports of lone parents being able to successfully raise chicks - so far I don't think he has received any affirmative reports.

allikat · « **Reply #48 on:** April 24, 2015, 12:35 »

Another feeding - I think this time, 1R left some food somewhere and she got the rest of it.

allikat · « **Reply #47 on:** April 24, 2015, 12:17 »

She truly is Alison!
I fear she is on her own to provide food and shelter for her chicks, as 1R just fly's around and eats - EVERYTHING!
It's going to be rough on Miep/VV - all three chicks ate this morning, thanks to Mum!

Alison · « **Reply #46 on:** April 24, 2015, 12:08 »

A third chick hatched this morning. Haven't had a good view of the chick so far.

Miep-VV also came home with food for the chicks this morning; a whole prey. She really is a remarkable falcon.

Alison · « **Reply #45 on:** April 24, 2015, 11:56 »

Quote from: susha on April 23, 2015, 14:07

Did One Ring bring the food I wonder?

I think it is highly unlikely that One Ring had anything to do with bringing the food. No-one saw him bring any food to the nest.

Not only that, he stole food from Miep-VV twice yesterday, once earlier in the day and once in the evening.

allikat · « **Reply #44 on:** April 23, 2015, 14:38 »

Not sure as Miep/VV left for a bit, then came back.
So, it's unknown as to if she had to hunt it herself, or took it from 1R?
From what I have translated, 1R isn't doing much to contribute, which will only make it that much harder and stressful for Miep/VV to care for all the chicks as they grow - and we all know how quickly they grow and how much they need to eat.
Time will tell (and so will the cameras)... $:-\$

susha · « **Reply #43 on:** April 23, 2015, 14:07 »

Did One Ring bring the food I wonder?

Alison · « **Reply #42 on:** April 23, 2015, 11:14 »

I was so happy to see Miep-VV with food in the nest when I checked the site a little while ago, and to see the new chick!

One Ring watched part of the feeding from the platform.

allikat · « **Reply #41 on:** April 23, 2015, 10:35 »

There is a feeding going on right now.

allikat · « **Reply #40 on:** April 23, 2015, 10:31 »

There are now two chicks - and it doesn't look like either one has been fed.
I hope things turn around and these little ones get fed along with Miep/VV.
Nature can be so beautiful, and yet so cruel at the same time.

Alison · « **Reply #39 on:** April 23, 2015, 06:29 »

Miep-VV is finally back, but she has no food.

Alison · « **Reply #38 on:** April 23, 2015, 06:27 »

The tiny chick:

One Ring with the chick:

Alison · « **Reply #37 on:** April 23, 2015, 05:43 »

The cams have now been turned back on, but I don't know whether the situation has been resolved.

There is one beautiful little chick, and another egg has a good-sized pip. However, One Ring has not brought food. Miep-VV left the nest, presumably to go hunting, and has not yet returned. One Ring went into the nest, studied the chick, and almost stepped on the little one.

I hope Mom will be back very soon. The tiny chick cannot be left for long.

Alison · « **Reply #36 on:** April 23, 2015, 03:55 »

The cam view did not just get stuck. This was posted by VWG Gemert:

04.23.2015 | 10:09 | VWG Gemert

Due to abuse of our images, we have turned off the refresh. Sorry for the inconvenience.

No idea what this is about. At such a crucial time, too . . .

Alison · « **Reply #35 on:** April 23, 2015, 03:37 »

Quote from: allikat on April 17, 2015, 17:41

I am so very confused now - I've gone through some of the video clips and after the 8th of April, when it was assumed that Pa was no longer the resident male, he was back on April 12th, (maybe 13th ....?), with Miep/VieVie and in the Nestbox.
I've been going over the videos and translating them - and I have no idea who is the resident male here especially after that battle the other day.
And from what I have also translated (love Google), Pa was not part of those battles.

From April 8 on, the first intruder male was at the nest. He has some speckled markings on his bib, so he became known as Spikkel (not a name, just to differentiate him from the second intruder male). Then there was an intruder female, who was banded at Essen three years ago. She came to the nest box entrance and looked in, but seemed to move on quickly.

And then there was the second intruder male, who did not show up at the nest at that time, but who battled with Spikkel in the skies above the tower for hours on end, on several different days. He has a silver band on his left leg.

He appears to have displaced Spikkel and to be at the nest now. He is known as One Ring (or 1 Ring), I assume because of the one silver band.

The bad part is that he does not bring food for Miep-VV or support her in any way. Yesterday he stole food from her, which she had in the nest.

In the meantime Miep-VV has also had to deal with another intruder female. She has not been able to incubate full time, but has steadfastly continued to do her best to keep incubating.

I have not seen Pa, but as far as i know he is still out there. I hope he is okay.

The first chick has now apparently hatched; I have not yet seen the chick, and the cam which shows the inside view of the nest is now stuck.

I don't know how Miep-VV can possibly care for a newly hatched chick in addition to having to hunt and provide food. And there is no way of knowing what One Ring's attitude will be to a chick which is not his. In many cases a new male will not accept another male's chick.

I have also been watching the Zielitz nest, where chicks had hatched. It seems as if there has been a change of male there, and the chicks were not fed. Only one chick is now left alive; heartbreaking to watch.

I can only hope things will go better at de Mortel.

susha · « **Reply #34 on:** April 22, 2015, 20:35 »

I think there's been a hatch. There was a pip in an egg last night and I just saw an eggshell when Miep-VieVie was shuffling around on the eggs.

susha · « **Reply #33 on:** April 21, 2015, 16:34 »

Fascinating nest-site this!

allikat · « **Reply #32 on:** April 21, 2015, 12:47 »

I guess the new male is 1R.
All the viewers seem to think that Pa is still around, as some claim they hear him, AND... he may have dropped food off for Miep-VV today?!?!?
There is a video and no one knows who it was - but there are speculations that it was Pa.
Oh the drama...

irenekl · « **Reply #31 on:** April 18, 2015, 10:07 »

Glad to know I am not the only one who is confused.

I'm really interested to know where Pa is.

allikat · « **Reply #30 on:** April 17, 2015, 17:41 »

I am so very confused now - I've gone through some of the video clips and after the 8th of April, when it was assumed that Pa was no longer the resident male, he was back on April 12th, (maybe 13th ....?), with Miep/VieVie and in the Nestbox.
I've been going over the videos and translating them - and I have no idea who is the resident male here especially after that battle the other day.
And from what I have also translated (love Google), Pa was not part of those battles.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #29 on:** April 17, 2015, 16:18 »

Quote from: irenekl on April 17, 2015, 10:56

For some reason I can't open the video clips at this site this year. I have the live feed and read the updates. Any suggestions?

I had no problem opening/viewing using Firefox 37.0.1 ... if that helps any ... $:-\$

susha · « **Reply #28 on:** April 17, 2015, 15:06 »

That's a mystery, Irene! I can usually open them with no trouble

irenekl · « **Reply #27 on:** April 17, 2015, 10:56 »

For some reason I can't open the video clips at this site this year. I have the live feed and read the updates. Any suggestions?

GCG · « **Reply #26 on:** April 16, 2015, 14:23 »

Quote from: allikat on April 16, 2015, 13:36

Hi everyone,

Well, things aren't looking that great at the beginning of incubation. According to the videos, peregrines have been battling behind the nestbox.
Not sure of the outcome... Hoping that neither bird is injured.

I just watched the videos, allikat. They indeed look vicious. Hopefully all is well now, although they are dated today.

allikat · « **Reply #25 on:** April 16, 2015, 13:36 »

Hi everyone,

Well, things aren't looking that great at the beginning of incubation. According to the videos, peregrines have been battling behind the nestbox.
Not sure of the outcome... Hoping that neither bird is injured.

GCG · « **Reply #24 on:** April 15, 2015, 13:41 »

Thanks susha. Right click worked. Translate with Bing. It sounds windy there too!

susha · « **Reply #23 on:** April 15, 2015, 11:17 »

GCG, I just accessed the site from my computer at work (for the first time - that's dangerous...no more work getting done

) and to get the page translated, I just right clicked on the mouse and the option to translate came up

susha · « **Reply #22 on:** April 15, 2015, 11:02 »

Mine just translates automatically and I can't remember is I made that happen long ago when I first started watching this site

Still a mystery, this "family". Looks like the intruder spent the night again last night. When I took a look last evening, Miep-VieVie and the U/K male were snoozing away, heads tucked into their back feathers, looking relaxed and comfortable in each others' company.

GCG · « **Reply #21 on:** April 15, 2015, 06:46 »

Can anyone tell me is there is a translate link on this site? Since we upgraded to a newer version of Windows, we no longer get a translate link automatically. Thanks!

susha · « **Reply #20 on:** April 13, 2015, 21:04 »

It seems that PA is still around and so is the intruding male, who sometimes sits in the nest box with Miep-VieVie who incubates her eggs as though there's nothing unusual about having two males apparently sharing a territory.

MayShowers · « **Reply #19 on:** April 11, 2015, 14:55 »

Quote from: Jazzerkins on April 08, 2015, 15:58

I think that as most of us know her as VieVie, the hyphenated name might be the best way to go.

My thoughts also.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #18 on:** April 10, 2015, 10:19 »

Just a note about the eggs Miep-VieVie is now incubating ... the male may not do anything to them. When T-Rex took over for his father while Madame was incubating at the Radisson there was no missed beat and no problems. All the eggs hatched out without a problem and there was never any discord between Madame and T-Rex - well, other than he liked to incubate as much as she did. Have more photos of him incubating than her in fact ...

Kinderchick · « **Reply #17 on:** April 09, 2015, 00:24 »

Quote from: sparkster on April 08, 2015, 18:27

Quote from: Jazzerkins on April 08, 2015, 15:58
I think that as most of us know her as VieVie, the hyphenated name might be the best way to go.

I agree with the hyphenated name.

Ditto for me.

sparkster · « **Reply #16 on:** April 08, 2015, 19:33 »

Quote from: allikat on April 08, 2015, 11:33

Too bad for Pa
At least, for now, he is staying away.
I know that falcons will have a territorial battle and fight to the death, but, I recall TPC writing that they will also choose to not fight (I think that's sort of right, TPC?)
I hope that Pa decides to not fight again, but if he does, there is nothing we can do about it, and he has had a great run at De Mortel.

Is anyone else having issues with the link to their cams?

I had no issues this evening with the cams. But good grief! I didn't check that site for a few days, only to find about all of the drama. I am very sorry for Pa and VieVie. I really like Pa.

He and VieVie had four wonderful chicks last year, and they were all so much fun to watch. Poor VieVie must be so traumatized with her four eggs to incubate, Pa gone, and this stranger in the nest box. And the stranger was definitely in the nest box a short while ago. It is very sad. I, too, hope that Pa stays away if he isn't going to win the fight.

sparkster · « **Reply #15 on:** April 08, 2015, 18:27 »

Quote from: Jazzerkins on April 08, 2015, 15:58

I think that as most of us know her as VieVie, the hyphenated name might be the best way to go.

I agree with the hyphenated name.

Jazzerkins · « **Reply #14 on:** April 08, 2015, 15:58 »

I think that as most of us know her as VieVie, the hyphenated name might be the best way to go.

The Peregrine Chick · « **Reply #13 on:** April 08, 2015, 15:52 »

Question for the group - do we keep with VieVie for the female or give her back her original name. Some projects have hyphenated the name when it has been found a named bird already had a name - so Miep-VieVie.

Let me know and we'll can change the threads (or not). Once folks have had the opportunity to comment, I'll possibly take these "comment" posts out so as to keep the flow of the observations clear.

allikat · « **Reply #12 on:** April 08, 2015, 11:33 »

Too bad for Pa

At least, for now, he is staying away.
I know that falcons will have a territorial battle and fight to the death, but, I recall TPC writing that they will also choose to not fight (I think that's sort of right, TPC?)
I hope that Pa decides to not fight again, but if he does, there is nothing we can do about it, and he has had a great run at De Mortel.

Is anyone else having issues with the link to their cams?

Kinderchick · « **Reply #11 on:** April 07, 2015, 23:16 »

Very interesting & informative, Alison. I did not know a lot of what you just posted. Thank you!

Alison · « **Reply #10 on:** April 07, 2015, 22:39 »

I have always known the resident female at this site as Miep, not VV. She was named Miep soon after she arrived at the nest. Miep is a Dutch diminutive of Maria.

Someone at another site named her VV. VV stands for "Vreemde vrouw", or "unknown woman". Miep is unbanded, so it will never be known where she came from.

Pa and Miep currently have four eggs in the nest.

However, there have been territorial battles at the nest yesterday and today, and the great tiercel Pa has been displaced by an intruder.

The intruder has been seen today in the nest box and on top of the nest box. Miep, meanwhile, has continued to incubate.

People from the Dutch forum have been on site searching for Pa. They have reported back that in their opinion Pa is alive and is okay. They think that he is staying away from the nest since he feels that he could not win a battle against this extremely aggressive intruder. Pa may also have a leg injury. I would also suggest that Pa would stay away from the nest in order to keep the eggs safe, and to prevent the intruder from coming into the nest box to continue the fight.

It is not known how old Pa is, but he is far from young. He is somewhere in the range of 13 to 20 years old. When most of his band numbers were read last year, the information was sent to an expert, and he commented that Pa was "very old" because of the type of bands he has. Pa first arrived at this nest in 2005; this is his eleventh year at de Mortel.

I don't know what will happen next, but I am hoping for the best.

birdcamfan · « **Reply #9 on:** April 06, 2015, 21:25 »

That Pa has excellent gametes!

Kinderchick · « **Reply #8 on:** March 17, 2015, 09:41 »

Hooray for Pa & VieVie!

sparkster · « **Reply #7 on:** March 15, 2015, 09:10 »

Pa and VieVie have an egg!!

susha · « **Reply #6 on:** February 21, 2015, 09:08 »

Woo hoo! Won't be long now

sparkster · « **Reply #5 on:** February 18, 2015, 08:25 »

Someone is in the nest now in what looks like a scrape, pecking at stones. I hope it is VieVie.

sparkster · « **Reply #4 on:** February 16, 2015, 09:33 »

Quote from: susha on February 15, 2015, 10:43

I forget how to start a new thread, so will just post on this one

Cams are back up at this site!!

Thank you for the reminder. Yay!!

birdcamfan · « **Reply #3 on:** February 16, 2015, 08:25 »

This is an update from the bloggers. I hope there is no drama this year but I say that every year!
21:14 pm
VWG Gemert
"Welcome visitors Experience Spring 2015
When going online Experience of Spring are the falcons few weeks their preparations to take for the next breeding season. A danger that now looms are the wandering homeless peregrine falcons that can hijack the closet.

2014 was a very successful and successful season for peregrine falcons in De Mortel. PA and VV have 4 beautiful boy reared, two females and two males. Little to no serious disruption of intruders, good weather and sufficient prey. For the female was her second brood, a lot more experienced than in 2013 but was still extremely caring. PA, the now 13 years or older experienced male, it does still excellent and together with VV still present on and around the tower of De Mortel.
The falcons are increasingly now and see around the hive. A danger so the wandering homeless peregrines seeking a suitable and secure nest site. In particular, a takeover by a female may lead to the demise of a hatch. And a strange woman has in recent days been several times to visit!

irenekl · « **Reply #2 on:** February 15, 2015, 16:54 »

Thankyou Susha!!

susha · « **Reply #1 on:** February 15, 2015, 10:43 »

I forget how to start a new thread, so will just post on this one

Cams are back up at this site!!

webcam link: http://www.beleefdelente.nl/vogel/slechtvalk

2015 Forum link: http://perigrines.nl/forumtest/viewtopic.php?t=675&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=3025